PLEASE RESPECT MY WISHES!!!!

[Ace Antilles]

<B>I have just discovered that Walther has uploaded my WHOLE site menu to his web server. <A HREF="http://www.imperial-center.co.uk/heir/" TARGET=_blank>http://www.imperial-center.co.uk/heir/</A> <P>I have been in contact with him about linking to his project. He wanted me to Endorse it. Now there's no fucking way!!<P>Now he isn't spreading the link around and maybe he is just practising building a site. I haven't spoken to him yet.<BR>BUT I DON'T CARE!!!<BR>It's online and I found the page easily enough!<BR>This is the whole site first pages with only the main content changed. Even the name and the Counter are there so he is racking up hits for me!<P>I make my site for me and fun and to benefit you. I clearly state on my pages not to use or copy any of the items I make personally.<P>If I find ANYONE has done anything like this again I will just REMOVE my whole site and go into other games editing!!<P>IF PEOPLE STEAL MY WORK I JUST WON'T MAKE ANY ANYMORE.</B><BR><P>------------------<BR><I>Going in Full Throttle!</I><BR><A HREF="http://www.antilles100.freeserve.co.uk" TARGET=_blank>The X-wing Outpost</A><BR>Home of The Batlle of Yavin and Endor projects.

[Darksaber]

<B>Cheeky little bastard,<P>This Jerk must be stopped NOW!</B>

[TIMMAY]

Thats just plain stupid, how hard is it to come up with a new design.<P>------------------<BR>Creator of the WWII Shipset : <A HREF="http://www25.brinkster.com/timmyxwa/shipset" TARGET=_blank>http://www25.brinkster.com/timmyxwa/shipset</A> <P>Or just visit my site at <A HREF="http://www25.brinkster.com/timmyxwa" TARGET=_blank>http://www25.brinkster.com/timmyxwa</A>

[Defiant]

It looks like he just copied the frameset. Weird.

[WarHawk107]

OMFG! if he plans on using that as his final site, he's a F*king retard! since i havent seen his site advertised on the boards i guess he could be using the layout of your site as a guidline for what he's planning...the Shipset however dosent look that bad <BR>BTW how did you find that site? Search Engine?<P>Ryan<p>[This message has been edited by WarHawk107 (edited 04 April 2002).]

[Ace Knight 1]

what a loser. Copying your site like that. *shakes his head*

[Abolisher]

You don't have to load another person's site menu to "practice." There are numerous tutorials for learning about frames and so forth. I used a tutorial to learn about frames when I re-did my site.<P>Even if you save some else's HTML code to your local drive for use as a reference, you can at least generate an original work before uploading anything. Uploading someone else's code to your site doesn't give you any practice at anything! Practice means making your own from scratch.<P>How many DarkJediMoose-I Play Runscape 1.X-Rintar-pimangalaxy copycat wankers do we whave in this community?<P>If it were me, I'd consider taking legal action. That guy's got more audacity than I've seen in a long time.<p>[This message has been edited by Abolisher (edited 04 April 2002).]

[Freelancer_MSE]

Jeez! the whole site! It's not hard at all to learn frames, Some sites even have them for download. I've never seen copying quite to that level of being overdone!<P>------------------<BR>Visit my webpage, <A HREF="http://www.freewebz.com/freelancermse" TARGET=_blank>Freelancers Spaceport</A>.

[DataDroid]

Man, ripping off someone else's model is one thing, but ripping off the team??? Man, we have sunk to new levels of stupidity <P>------------------<BR>"Do you pirate software?"<BR>"What's that have to do with anything"<BR>"Everything! Software piracy leads to fines, fines lead to jail, jail leads to suffering!"<P>Member of the <A HREF="http://coruscant.x1.nl/" TARGET=_blank>Imperial City Project</A>

[GreenLeader0]

Oh god... this man should be hog-tied, tarred, and feathered. Or we can just boot him out of the forums.

[Walther]

I already replied by email and by XWAU forums but....<P>A) sorry about that - but i did NOT upload this site to my server. The frames page just linked to the menu so i could see what it looked like in your style.<BR>b) it has been removed - the page was only there so Ace could see how it looked in his frames.<BR>c)i did NOT steal any of your stuff - i am capable of making my own site in HTML, as you can see if you'd looked at the main page there. I DEFINITELY did not want to use that as my final site - I NEVER steal others work or copy others work to that extent.<BR>d) I know how to use frames. Thats WHY it looked like i'd uplaoded the whole site - the menu just appeared in the left frame and then you could go to all of ace's site.<BR>e) I am not a stupid guy. If i hypothetically was going to steal your design I would not really leave you name, menu design, shipsets, opts and everything on there - even tho I have made it clear that plagarism is not my thing anyway. <P>I did NOT want to cause any bad feelings here - i didnt copy the site! The intention was that Ace could see how my pages would look in his menu system - I hadn't even given him that link yet because my pages were not complete - when they were complete i would have deleted the index page. The page could NOT be found in a search engine, either, because that section has not been submitted to the search engine thingy yet.<P>Theres a lot of people whose work i repsect posting here - I don't want to lose any cred in their eyes for something that was not really intentional and not quite what has been claimed. There is NO WAY i would use someone elses work and claim it as mine - some people here should know that when I have asked them for permission to use their opts. I CAN make my own HTML - it is far more cutomisable than stealing other peoples anyway.<P>Sorry, Ace. I didnt mean to cause that upset - but i did not copy your stuff in any way. If theres any way I can make up for any of this big mistake then just say it.

[General Edor Crespin]

Then why does his stuff show up in the left frame? Wouldn't it have been easy enough to edit out that part of the HTML?<P>------------------<BR>"Life? You have a life? Wow! Can I have one?"<P>Visit my site, the <I><A HREF="http://crespin.xwlegacy.net" TARGET=_blank>SSD Shadowkeeper</A></I>!<BR>AIM @ <B>MIDI Master Jade</B>!<BR>MSN @ <B>marajade21e@hotmail.com</B>!<p>[This message has been edited by General Edor Crespin (edited 04 April 2002).]

[Ace Knight 1]

ahhhh okay

[Abolisher]

Blah, blah, blah.<P>Bottom line: there is no excuse for linking or uploading someone else's menu to your site, period.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>...so i could see what it looked like in your style.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Right, to see if it was worth copying? Using the same buttons or background? Why not do something original from the beginning?<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>I NEVER steal others work or copy others work to that extent.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Stealing to <B>any</B> extent is wrong. Borrowing without permission is wrong.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>- i didnt copy the site!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Linking in a manner that causes another person's webpage to appear in your frames <B>by default</B> is copying. Duh. <P>[Edit] (Note: I'm not talking about when you <B>click a link</B> in a framed site and then have another site appear within the said frames. That's fairly common. I'm talking about having someone's else's page(s) appear in the said frames by <B>default</B>, i.e. when the page is first loaded by a visitor's browser).[/Edit] <P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>...for something that was not really intentional.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>ROTFL! Oh, I see, you accidentally linked your frames page to Ace's menu! What kind of idiots do you take this community for that anyone one of us would actually believe that!<P>Actually, I'm not going to take any more time picking apart your paper house of excuses. There's two things that are important here...<P>1. You should have asked permission before having Ace's menu appear in your frames, <B>regardless of your reason</B> for doing so.<P>2. After making this mistake, you should have just apologized instead of wasting bandwidth with irrelevant excuses.<P>[Edit] Oh, and BTW, I'm not trying to discourage your project or run you away from the community. I'm just saying that you should have handled this better. All you needed to do was apoligize and admit your mistake, not take us for idiots with lame excuses.[/Edit]<p>[This message has been edited by Abolisher (edited 04 April 2002).]

[Defiant]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ace Knight 1:<BR><B>Linking in a manner that causes another person's webpage to appear in your frames is copying. Duh. </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>FYI, there's actually case law on this topic. In most cases, linking is not considered the same as copying.

[Rogue]

Abolisher, this matter is between Walther and Ace. Let's keep it that way.

[Abolisher]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><I>by Defiant</I><BR>In most cases, linking is not considered the same as copying.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Actually, the quote was by me, not Ace Knight 1. <P>This case law primarily applies to linking to a site with a clickable image or string of text right? Like most of us do? Certainly it can't be <B>legal</B> to have someone elses web page appear as the <B>default</B> page in your frames...sure, you can have someone else's page load in your frames after clicking a link, but to have it there by default? That's equivalent to making someone else's page your home page, and therefore equivalent to copying, if not in a legal sense but in a moral sense. <P>If this is legal, then it needs to be made illegal. That wouldn't suprise me though, since lawmakers are having trouble keeping up with the rate of new internet abuses.<P>Oh and <B>Rogue</B>, Ace Antilles decides who this matter is between. Not you. Ace posted this thread, thus implying that he wants community involvement in this issue so long as this thread remains open. Therefore, I'm welcome to participate in this discussion until <P>1) Ace tells me to stop, <B>a decision I will be happy to respect</B> since he decides who to involve in the matter or,<P>2) Ace closes this thread.<P>As you can see, you are <B>not</B> in a position to decide who is involved. Now <B>if</B> it were <B>you</B> who this happened to, that would be a different story. <P>Walther did apoligize...I just took issue with his excuses. At this point, I don't see that there's any more to talk about, since the problem has been fixed.<p>[This message has been edited by Abolisher (edited 04 April 2002).]

[Hutch]

*Downs a Ruby Bliels and takes a seat.*<P>------------------<BR>Hutchman<P>Commander<BR>SFA New Republic Armed Forces<BR>Starfighter Command<BR>X.O. Freedom Wing<BR>C.O. Raptor Squadron<BR><A HREF="http://www.the-sfa.org" TARGET=_blank>Star Fighters Alliance</A>

[Rogue]

I know that I'm in no position to dictate what happens on these forums. I was simply advising you to stop flaming before another person either gets driven away from the community, or banned. (I believe the former has happened more than once -with- your involvement)<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Walther did apoligize...I just took issue with his excuses. At this point, I don't see that there's any more to talk about, since the problem has been fixed.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Good. Glad we agree.

[Ace Knight 1]

ZHmm wonder wjhy it said I posted that...nm

[Abolisher]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>I know that I'm in no position to dictate what happens on these forums.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Then don't take that position.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>I was simply advising you to stop flaming before another person either gets driven away from the community, or banned. (I believe the former has happened more than once -with- your involvement)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Must you open another can of worms with another dig? Would you care to substantiate this outrageous claim with some examples and enlightenment as to exactly how I contributed to the banishment of another community member? In your explanation, demonstrate how I was responsible for the actions of the indiviual(s) that resulted in their banishment.<P>Here's a little enlightenment for you...people get themselves banned by their own actions. Not mine or anyone else's.<P>[sarcasm]Yeah, when <B>Rintar</B> was on his little forum rampage a few weeks ago, flaming everyone, I was there twisting his arm and forcing him to do it. Yep, it was my fault that he got banned.[/sarcasm]<P>Your understanding of the relationship between consequences and the actions that lead to those consequences is sadly off the mark.

[Ace Antilles]

Right ok let's put an end to this!<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Walther:<BR><B>A) sorry about that - but i did NOT upload this site to my server. The frames page just linked to the menu so i could see what it looked like in your style.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>I know exactly what you did. I know you didn't upload the whole site.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ace Antilles:<BR><B>Now he isn't spreading the link around and maybe he is just practising building a site. I haven't spoken to him yet.<BR>BUT I DON'T CARE!!!<BR>It's online and I found the page easily enough!.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>There was <B>NO</B> need to UPLOAD the frames to see what it looked like in my style! Ever heard of a local server? Once you made your page you could have just opened it with an active web connection and everything would have loaded. You didn't have to put it up at all.<BR>PLUS you should have taken it down straight away afterwards!<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally by Walther:<BR><B>b) it has been removed - the page was only there so Ace could see how it looked in his frames.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>This all started from your E-mails:<BR><B>Quote: "I can do my own pages, even in the same style as yours if you like.<BR>OK. I await your reply."</B><P>Except you didn't did you. You had already gone ahead and made them and uploaded them!<BR>And I think I know how a black page with writing in looks like?<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally by Walther:<BR><B>c)i did NOT steal any of your stuff - i am capable of making my own site in HTML, as you can see if you'd looked at the main page there. I DEFINITELY did not want to use that as my final site - I NEVER steal others work or copy others work to that extent.<BR>d) I know how to use frames. Thats WHY it looked like i'd uplaoded the whole site - the menu just appeared in the left frame and then you could go to all of ace's site.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>So far all I see you is you've made 2 pages. Again there was NO need to upload it to view it correctly. <P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally by Walther:<BR><B>The intention was that Ace could see how my pages would look in his menu system - I hadn't even given him that link yet because my pages were not complete - when they were complete i would have deleted the index page.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>You jumped the gun hoping I would "endorse" your project. You should have WAITED till I answered your email before even wasting your time trying.<BR>It gets worse. So you were going to complete the pages, upload them and carry on till you had done it? <B>Then</B> delete the index!<BR>And yes you didn't give me that link. But generally there is a main page a download page is linked from. I actually wanted to see it, so I found it. it took 2 seconds! That is your main site still isn't it?<BR>If you didn't want that link seen then you should have put it somewhere else!<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally by Walther:<BR><B>Sorry, Ace. I didnt mean to cause that upset - but i did not copy your stuff in any way.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>And what do you call <B>copying</B> my Frameset and then uploading it to your FTP? It is still work created by me for MY site!<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally by Abolisher:<BR><B>Ace Antilles decides who this matter is between. Not you. Ace posted this thread, thus implying that he wants community involvement in this issue so long as this thread remains open.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>That's right. I wanted everyone to be my witness. I dealt with this on E-mail too. So if I didn't want other's input it wouldn't be here! I also needed to get rid of my anger.<BR>Rogue: There's one thing I can't stand is other people trying to moderate a forum. Especially one I run. And to both of you keep your arguments of my forum!<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally by Walther:<BR><B>If theres any way I can make up for any of this big mistake then just say it.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>There isn't. The only way is to make a earth shattering project now and prove me wrong.<BR>I <B>know</B> you meant well but you did it wrong. When I found myself looking at my site I thought I had typed the wrong link. How would you feel if I did it to you? It really pissed me off!<BR>I'm sorry but you have become an example of what happens when I'm angry.<P>Consider yourself <B>BANNED</B> from my Forum. All future posts will be deleted until such time as I see fit.<P>A warning to anyone else who copies my work.<BR><B>IF PEOPLE STEAL MY WORK I JUST WON'T MAKE ANY ANYMORE.</B><P>------------------<BR><I>Going in Full Throttle!</I><BR><A HREF="http://www.antilles100.freeserve.co.uk" TARGET=_blank>The X-wing Outpost</A><BR>Home of The Batlle of Yavin and Endor projects.